Simon Cowell (The X Factor)

Simon Cowell made his presence known in the UK and brought his hit American Idol to America with the same fervor.  Now, after leaving his hit show, Cowell's next move is bringing the biggest show in UK history stateside.  We talk with Cowell about all the details of The X Factor and his feelings on the new American Idol.

SHAKEFIRE: It seems like everything you touch turns to gold.  What do you think that you have that enables you to do so well at spotting talent like Leona Lewis and doing unique programs like THE X FACTOR?

SIMON COWELL: Well, thank you.  Thanks for saying that.  Well, first of all, I put my trust in the audience, I trust my gut feeling, I work with talented people, and essentially what I try to do now – because I have a choice – is I make shows I’d like to watch.  We’ve been thinking about this show for a few years now, about whether we should do it or not do it in America, and we made the decision last year that we were going to do it.  Now that I have my head around it, I’m excited and I think we’re going to do something different.  I’m excited about it.  The stakes are high, but I have no idea what it’s going to look like until I start shooting.

SF: Would you like Paula Abdul to be one of the judges on THE X FACTOR?  I know you haven’t decided yet on the judges at this point.

SC: Well, I’m a massive fan of Paula.  It’s quite unusual – when you work with somebody for as long as I did with Paula, we were friends on the show for I’d say 80% of the time, and then interestingly, afterwards we’ve been in regular contact.  So I’m a big fan of hers.

I’m not going to say today on this call who we are going to confirm or who we’re not going to confirm because the truth is, we honestly haven’t made our minds up yet.  We’re talking to a number of people, and I expect to make an announcement I would say within three to four weeks – it might be a little bit longer, I’m not sure – as to who the panel are going to be.

SF: That having been said about the judges, do you think it’s important to have a British presence?  There’s been talk about you having Cheryl Cole or somebody.

SC: It’s interesting because I’ve never thought about whether it should be British or American.  I think it comes down to who I think is interesting, but the most important criteria for this show is the commitment and the expertise each person offers.  On this show, when you reach the live part of the show, each judge is going to mentor three finalists each, and that means you have to work with them up to five or six days a week.  I need to find someone who’s willing to make that commitment, because it is hard work. 

You are deciding on all of their material, how they’re going to perform on the night, you have to have a relationship with them, and I also think it’s really, really important, for me, that I have people I can trust in terms of their expertise, their gut feeling.  That’s why it’s a difficult decision, when you’re putting a team around you. 

I also think it’s important on a show like this that you have people who are very competitive with each other.  Essentially, the judges are taking part in this competition as well as the competitors.  You want somebody who is competitive.  That’s why the British/American thing, it’s not the most important thing; it’s who I’m hoping the American audience will find interesting and actually know what they’re talking about.  It also helps that they’re cute.

SF: If I could just jump to the announcement of the record deal, with today’s climate in the industry, were you at all nervous that maybe that’s too high of a deal?

SC: Yes, and I think you should be nervous.  The reason we decided to do this was to show the people who are auditioning for the show that, like I said in my press announcement, sometimes you have to put your money where your mouth is.  By putting up that kind of prize money, it’s a massive, massive risk, but it’s also an incredible incentive.  I think it puts everybody, rightly, under an enormous amount of pressure, because I didn’t want to go into this show without feeling a certain amount of pressure.  With pressure, you have to find a star.  I also did it because I believe I can find a star.

You know, I’m nervous, but I’m also confident that it was the right thing to do.  I think it should be a life-changing prize.  Just to be clear, this is not dressed-up $5 million; this is a guaranteed $5 million payable to the winner.  The recording costs, the marketing costs, the video costs are completely separate to that.  It will be paid over five years, $1 million a year for five years, and on top of the Sony label getting behind the artist, we will also be offering financial support for the winner so they don’t have to invest their money, look after their money, because that’s a lot of cash.

SF: Yes it is.  Which specific Sony label will this prize be going through?

SC: It’s a good question, actually.  The answer to the question is that I don’t think we should be guaranteeing at the moment to anyone.  There are a range of labels across Sony.  They are specialists in separate kinds of music.  I can remember, as an example, Clive Davis calling me about Leona Lewis when she was in the U.K. competition - she hadn’t won at that point – basically saying, “I want to get behind this girl.  I think she’s a star,” and he was the natural choice.

I think to be fair to the artist, we have to approach this in exactly the same way, which is whatever division of Sony is most supportive and can offer the most expertise to the artist, that’s the label we’re going to choose.

SF: Based on the type of music that person performs?

SC: Exactly.  You’re 100% right.

SF: One of the things I was interested in – I remember hearing when you first started IDOL that you were nervous about how American audiences would react to you and what you do.  You’ve been on IDOL for a while, you’ve seen how that translation works, and this sounds kind of weird, but I think we’ve seen with MTV and “Skins” how it can go off the rails, the translation of British to American. 

I wonder; what have you learned about what American audiences like, and how will that be reflected in what you do on THE X FACTOR?

SC: That’s a very good question.  I think we had exactly the same issues when we brought IDOL over to America in the first place, and why initially I was hesitant about doing the show, because I didn’t want there to be lots of rules and lots of people at the network saying this is what you can do, this is what you can’t do.  With this show, the format is a fairly simple format, which is, it’s open to all ages, we allow groups to compete, but it has to be, essentially, an all-American show with the commitment being to American talent. 

You know, I managed to do it twice.  I did it with AMERICAN IDOL; I did it with “America’s Got Talent.”  They both felt all-American and I’m confident that I can do the same thing with THE X FACTOR.  The reaction I’ve had from American people who’ve managed to watch the U.K. show has been very, very positive, and that’s one of the reasons why we decided to bring the show to America.  But like I said before, I don’t take anything for granted.

SF: Do you think there’s too much made of the differences between the two audiences, British and American?

SC: Yes.  You know, I do believe that.  I think a star is a star.  Interesting TV is interesting TV.  I don’t think you need to over-think it.  Like I said to someone on the earlier call, my commitment is to find the best producers I can to make the best possible show.  I’ve seen it happen also with “Dancing with the Stars.”  I think the American show is brilliant.  They did a fantastic job, and I’m sure ABC had the same reservations when they were thinking about bringing it over.  If you bring a good format with great producers and a commitment to try to do something different, then I think you have half a chance.  I put my trust in the American audience.  I have done that for ten years and will continue to.

SF: The press release we have, there’s a quote by Mike Darnell, but it does say that you, Simon, will be working both behind and in front of the camera.  So does that mean you are going to be a judge, and if you are not or you won’t comment on that, what kind of in-camera role would you see for yourself?

SC: Well, when I’m described as an executive producer, you have a vision for the show, and that’s very important before you start because you have to, in your mind, make the kind of show you want to make, you have a view on that, and I have some strong views on that in terms of what it will look like, why it will be different to other shows, the kinds of people who I’d like to work alongside me.  Once the show goes into production, I become a judge and I have to put my trust into the producers’ hands.  That’s effectively how it works in the U.K.

SF: So just to be clear, you are going to be a judge on this show?

SC: Yes. 

SF: I know on AMERICAN IDOL there was some kickback when it said 15-year-olds would be able to audition for this season, so what do you think about the age of 12 for a show like this?

SC: You know, I thought long and hard about this, to be honest with you.  I think probably five or six years ago I wouldn’t have done it.  Through experience, when I worked on “Britain’s Got Talent” and what happened this year on “America’s Got Talent,” there are some incredibly talented young kids out there, and because I work for a record label, over the last 12 months we’ve started to see a trend of what kids this age are capable of doing, whether they can withstand the pressure. 

I went on record years ago saying I think it’s wrong to have people around this age doing it, and now I think times have changed.  You have to make a case-by-case decision based on them as a person, whether they’re capable of doing this kind of thing, what their parental support is like.  We had to make that decision on Jackie on “America’s Got Talent” runner-up.  Once we were satisfied she was happy, the parents were happy, I think it was the right decision, and she’s on her way to a very, very successful career.

I, through my job, have started to see a new wave of how these kids are thinking.  What’s quite interesting is 12-year-olds now, they didn’t watch AMERICAN IDOL in the beginning because they would have been about two or three.  So they have their own opinions, they know what they’re doing, and you look at someone like Willow Smith – there’s a trend happening at the moment.  I think it would have been wrong to exclude them.  Again, I think it makes the competition more exciting, that maybe you’re going to find a 12-, 13-, 14-year-old genius performer who could be competing against a 45-year-old, and I like that idea.

SF: Good, good.  Regarding you being a judge, are we going to see the old Simon or is there going to be a new Simon before us, since you’re a producer now?

SC: You know, look, you adapt over the years.  I started to cringe over the years when I started to see people being booked as the so-called mean judge and just being gratuitously rude for the sake of it.  I don’t like that.  I have my own style.  I like to think that I’m honest.  I wouldn’t sugarcoat something just to make myself popular.  I’m going to try to be consistent to how I’ve been over the years.  I say that mainly because of people you meet in the street, that you talk to, where they say, “We like hearing what you have to say, Simon, because we kind of think the same way as you.”  So that’s the way I’m going to approach it.  People know what to expect if I’m on the judging panel, so I don’t see things are going to change too much.

SF: Any thoughts on the new IDOL judges – Tyler and J. Lo?

SC: Well, I haven’t seen a full episode yet.  I saw three minutes of a recap last week.  I think from what I’ve seen, from what I’ve heard, it all seems to be going well.  I always thought that would be the case.  What I was more concerned about was the ratings falling off a cliff, meaning that that whole genre is now over.  I think the good news is that people are still excited about these shows, whether it be that show, “Dancing with the Stars,” which has definitely gotten better over the years, “America’s Got Talent,” which the ratings have gone up over the years.  People, thank god, still like these shows, and that gives me more confidence when we launch ours.  I think the important distinction with THE X FACTOR is that it’s going to run in the fall, which it has done for seven years in the U.K.  I like having these shows on at that time of the year running up until Christmas time. 

Going back to your original question, I think they’ve done a good job.

SF: I guess from a mentoring aspect, it’s kind of what sets THE X FACTOR apart from a lot of just judging and voting shows.  How do you think it adds to the show itself?

SC: Well, the reason we replaced IDOL with THE X FACTOR in the U.K. to begin with is that I got bored of just judging.  I got frustrated when I kept criticizing people’s song choices, what they wore or what they didn’t do right.  I wanted to make a show where I actually, along with my fellow judges, could help the competitors on a weekly basis, because that’s what I do in my real job.  If you work for a record company you work with the artist on everything – their song choices, their stylists, their choreographers – and it made sense to me that we should do that on a TV show.

It’s definitely more interesting for me because I have a lot more to do.  Secondly, it’s an interesting thing, to be judged as well as the competitor.  When you lose an artist, part of you has lost as well.  When you’re artist wins, you win.  It really does become incredibly competitive between the judges once the competition starts.  In a way, they’re more competitive than the artist, because we don’t pretend to like each other.

SF: You said that the judges are competitive, so you’re going to be mentoring somebody and then critiquing their performance and of course, won’t you have a vested interest in being extra tough on the extra two judges’ people?

SC: Of course, and extra-nice to my own.  I think it’s amusing, to be honest with you, because we’re all experts when we sit together unanimously and just judge.  It’s a very, very different experience when you have to make a decision and then hear somebody else criticize you.  It’s funny – it goes back to making up the panel.  I have to put people on this panel who I genuinely think could be better than me so it becomes a real competition. 

Look, when somebody does a great job, you have to be fair.  That comes back to the honesty principle I’ve always abided to on these shows.  If they do a good job, they’ve done a good job.  If they’ve done a lousy job, I think you’re entitled to say that they’ve done a lousy job.

SF: You’ll be judging your own?

SC: You do actually judge your own, which makes you slightly more biased, but there have been times when I’ve been critical about my own work, because you want to do a great job every week.  It is a very, very different principle, as I said, because it is easy just to make comments.  When you’ve actually had to put the entire performance together yourself and your fellow judges are judging you, it’s very intimidating.

SF: You have always talked about the importance of “the X factor.”  You mentioned Lady Gaga, but what other artists out there today do you think have that same factor?

SC: Well, look, there are tons.  I mean, anyone from Beyoncé to Rihanna to The Black Eyed Peas, Justin Bieber, the GLEE cast.  I mean, this is a good time for the music business right now.  It kind of feels that we’ve come out of this grey period into a very, very fun, extreme time again.  I think records have gotten better, the artists have gotten better, and that’s why we decided in the promo campaign – I mean, we got a lot of support from successful artists to make the point of the kinds of people we wanted to find.  In the first promo we had Katy Perry, Justin Bieber, The Black Eyed Peas, Usher, Lady Gaga, The Pussycat Dolls, obviously Madonna.  We have a second promo coming out soon which features Rihanna, Backstreet Boys, Shakira, Jonas Brothers, Pink, Jay-Z.  They’ve all got it.

As you can see across there, there’s an enormous amount of variety.  There’s young, old, but this is a good time, and I think it’s a great time for people to get out of their safety mode and show to us that they’re different, they’re unique.  I’m most excited in a way about the groups.  I’d love the idea of finding a great group at the moment.  There’s a whole history of anything from the Jackson 5 to *NSYNC or recently, The Black Eyed Peas or Destiny’s Child selling all over the world, and that’s what I want to find on this show. 

I would even say to schools across the country – I’m seeing this a lot on YouTube now – how choirs have suddenly become really interesting, very contemporary, they have these great musical teachers they’re working with.  I’d invite them to come along on audition as well.  I’d love to find something like that, something different.